Chronos Digital Clock

All Things Chess
1

I think most would agree that the modes on this clock are a bit confusing. I think I have most of it figured out but I still have one issue to solve.

Does anyone know how to set a double time control with Fischer delay?

ex: 40/120, SD/30,inc/30

Thanks
Harry

2

Use CH-P4.

Alex Relyea

3

Thanks but both CH P4 and CH P5 work with only one time control. I am trying to set it up with more than one time control. I would also like to set it up with different increments for each time control if possible.

ex: 40/120,inc15, 10/60,inc5

Harry

4

I think there was a typo in the reply. You can use CH-P6 for two time controls with increment where the second time control is sudden death.

However, if you are looking for a non-sudden death time control, you need to use CH-P8, which allows you to set four time controls with increment. The fourth time control repeats indefinitely.

Note that in mode CH-P8, the clock does not count presses. That means that if you intend the increment to switch from 15 seconds to 5 seconds after both players complete 40 moves, that’s not what the clock will do. The clock will use an increment of 15 seconds for each player until the player uses up the two hours of the first time control. Then, and only then, will the clock move on to the second time control for that player. This is probably not what you want, and the Chronos does not have a mode that does what you want.

5

CH-P6 will work for two time controls, with different increments for each control, if you wish. (That is very unusual for rated play.) That’s the mode I used when we tried out the “FIDE Olympiad” control of 40/90, SD/30, Inc-30 from move one, at our club.

That mode—CH-P6—will work on any Chronos more recent than the ancient switch-on-bottom models. I think that newer Chronos models—as in more recent than my late '90s model—have a mode that will do what you wish and also display a move counter. (Which CH-P6 does not.)

We have established on these forums that move counters cause more problems than they solve, so that’s no great loss, though.

Try CH-P6. If it does not work, please post here what is the problem.

6

Ken,

That’s true of my 1998-ish vintage model. I am pretty sure newer Chronos models have modes equivalent to CH-P6 and CH-P7 but with move counters. Anyone know for sure?

7

Try Pr-C1 to get the move counter with increment.

8

What is Pr-C1? I have a Chronos that dates back to 2006 (new enough that it has capacitive switches instead of the mechanical clicky buttons), and I can’t find any trace of Pr-C1.

If I remember from your “Chronos repair” thread, you have a SamTimer. I am wondering if Pr-C1 might be specific to the SamTimer?

9

Near the end of the Chronos user’s manual, available online: is.gd/sbba9A is mention of the new Progressive (with increment) modes; page 56 of 58:

(NOTE: The formatting of the text below broke somehow; I’m too fried to mess with it.)

Additions to the User’s Guide

Six progressive modes have been added: PR- C1, PR- C2, PR- C1A, PR- C1B, PR - C2A, PR- C2B.

Intended use: Sudden-death chess with progressive timing and 2 or 3 time-controls.

Description:
These are progressive modes similar to CH - P6 and CH - P7, but with the addition of move counters.

PR - C1 has two time-controls. The move number is omitted in the second time-
control since you must play all of the rest of your moves before your time runs out.
PR - C1A is similar,except for this feature: the display of arunning clock willalways
show the time in hours, minutes, and seconds (instead of showing only hours and
minutes when the time is greater than ten minutes). To make room for the full time,
the move number is not shown on the running clock, although the move number on
the opponent’s clock, of course, is still shown. PR - C1B shows the move counter at
all times, that is, in both time-controls. This could be used in tournaments with a rule
such as “all games over 150 moves are a draw”.

The PR - C2, PR- C2A, andPR - C2B modes are similar to the above but with three
time-controls.

10

Eric, thanks for replying about Pr-C1. My Sam Timer is a Chronos with scrabble modes added. Otherwise itis identical.

Richard

11

Learn something new every day!

One caveat: These modes still will not implement the example time control of 40/120 inc/30, 10/60 inc/5 repeating indefinitely. Both modes assume the last time control is a sudden death time control.

12

IMHO it is extremely unwise to run a tournament with different increments (or delays) for the different controls, or with increment (or delay) turned on only for the final control.

There are a number of reasons for this, some of which have been hinted at in this thread.

  • Many clocks do not support such combinations.
  • Those clocks which do support it do so in different ways. Some switch to the second-control increment at move 40 (or whatever). Some switch when each player has used up his first-control time. With the former, you’d have to turn on the move counter. With the latter, players will receive the new increment at different times. (For example, with 40/60 inc/0, SD/30 inc/5, if white uses up his first hour at move 43, and black at move 57, then for 14 moves white will have the increment but black will not.)
  • Players are now accustomed to having delay or increment turned on throughout the game. Not having it on might result in an unpleasant surprise for a player whose time expires after taking only 2 seconds to move.
  • Having zero increment or delay, even in a non-SD control, tends to invite bad behavior, such as using two hands, knocking over pieces without replacing them, etc.
  • That bad behavior tends to disrupt other games still being played on neighboring boards.

Please, organizers, use the same increment or delay (and never zero) throughout the game.

Bill Smythe

13

Agreed completely for standard USCF-rated tournaments, if only for practical reasons.

It remains true, though, that World Championship matches are played with increment only in the final, ultimate control: 40/120, 20/60, SD/15, Inc-30 (61).

A few top GM events still use that control, as well, though less so since FIDE limited the controls that can be used for norm events. If it works for Anand and Kramnik…

14

Are the clocks set so that increment actually begins at move 61, i.e. is the move counter on? Or does the arbiter have to (somehow) turn on the increment by hand at move 61?

Bill Smythe

15

Great responses all. I even have the additional instruction page which explains the added pr modes but just didn’t read it. Of course I agree that these time controls don’t work well in tournament play but I wanted to know if the setting was possible. The chronos is the best clock on the market IMHO. I also own the Saitek competition pro and although it is step down from the Chronos, it is a good clock for most applications.

Thanks for all the expertise on this issue.

Harry

16

This I do not know. If arbiter intervention is required, that is not an issue in a WC match and not a big issue in an elite GM Round-Robin.

It would, of course, spark chaos at your average weekend Swiss in the trenches of USCF—even above the trench-line, perhaps.

That is why my good friend and hero Angelo DePalma likes delay/increment only in the final control. There is logic behind this POV, but the practical problems it would cause in a large Swiss far outweigh the ‘purity’ of it all.

17

When you figure out how to set the silver Saitek comfortably for standard time controls, please share the secret. That is the one digital clock I have trouble setting. (Have not yet tried the DGT NA; that might change this weekend.) Even the simpler blue scholastic-marketed Saitek is not that hard to set, but the silver Competition Pro model is too deep for me.

Most of my immediate chess-mates say digital clocks are tough to set correctly—or at least much tougher than they should be. I never tire of telling them that if I—left-handed, near-sighted, middle-aged simpleton—can do it, so can they.

Then someone hands me a Saitek Pro he bought years before, that has gathered dust in his chess bag since…and I am out of counterplay.

One piece of advice: Do not read the Saitek manual. Have fun.

18

The Saitek is pretty straight forward. Most of the tournament settings are preset in 3A - 3G and can be edited for different times. Lots of useless stuff preset throughout. Does anyone have a use for hourglass mode:?:

There is room at 7A - 7C for user defined presets but I think only 7B has more than one TC. All the modes are listed underneath the clock.

Not really sure what you’re having trouble with. Can you be more specific?

Harry

19

You must be joking. The trouble, simply, is setting it. The instructions are impossible, and it’s counter-intuitive. You remind me of the guys in the computer forums who first want to know the color of your grandmother’s social security card before they pretend to help you.

Last time I took the Saitek out of my bag I begged several players who were actually USING the exact same model to help me set it, to no avail. Even a team of 9-year-old Asian kids couldn’t overcome its mysteries. A month ago God visited me in a dream and told me I had to wait until I died to understand the Saitek.

The only thing going for the Saiteks is the eerie green move indicator built into the plunger button. Even a nearly-blind, overweight, rating-obsessed, hung-over individual can see whose move it is from 200 feet away. And I’m not talking about Eric Mark.

A couple of years ago at the USATE Hanon Russel turned down my offer to sell my LIKE-NEW Saitek on spec. He would not even give me a score pad for it. Nay, not even a microscopic, pink-and-orange festoon for my commemorative USATE pencil.

As the whippersnappers like to say on the investment boards, it’s a POC.

Angelo DePalma

20

Gosh, I’m so sorry I remind you of those guys. Not to worry, I won’t pretend to help you.

Harry