Does anyone have any recommendations for setting 40/90, SD/30; i30 on a Chronos, a Blitz Chronos, a North American DGT and a ZMart?
I assume the blue Saitek does not do increment?
Thank you.
For any Chronos II (long, full-length version of the Chronos) except for the very oldest, use mode CH-P6. If you want the time control to be precisely the same as the DGT and other clocks, add 30 seconds to the starting base time.
Note that mode does not include a clock-press counter. Chronos II clocks from about 2003 onwards include mode PR-C1, which is like CH-P6 except with a clock press counter added. chesspraga.cz/download/manua … Manual.pdf
The blue Saitek does not support increment. It only does delay.
One question that always comes up when there are two time controls (e.g. 40/90, SD/30) is, should the clock add the second control (e.g. 30 minutes) after move 40 has been completed, or only when the first control has expired?
This question comes up no matter whether there is increment, or delay, or (shudder) neither.
Some players like the second control to be added when the move count reaches 40. It is reassuring to see the 30 minutes (or whatever the 2nd control is) added at just the right time.
Other players (and, especially, some TDs) prefer to have the 30 minutes (or whatever) added only when the original 90 minutes (or whatever) is used up. People on this side of the fence argue that move counters may become inaccurate (due to a missed or extra clock press) so it’s better not to have the move counter trigger the next control.
But then a player might ask, “Hey, I just played my 40th move, why didn’t the clock add 30 minutes?” and then the opponent or TD has to explain that the time will be added when the initial 90 minutes is used up.
If you are organizing or TD’ing a tournament where the players furnish the clocks, the players will set their clocks whichever way they please, some one way, some the other, and you may end up with questions asked or disputes to settle at move 40.
If the organizer or TD furnishes the clocks, he or she can exercise discretion and set all the clocks the same way.
On the Chronos models, if you want the move counter to trigger the next control, set it for one of the modes that displays the move count. Or if you want the first-control time expiration to trigger the next control, set it for one of the modes that does not display the move count.
The DGT North American is a bit trickier. It always counts moves, even if there is only one time control, but never displays the move count. If you want to see the move count during the game, you have to press the plus + button (at least I think that’s it) briefly, without stopping the clock first. Most players don’t seem to know about this, and many likely would be afraid to try it even if they did know.
But that clock lets you have it either way. If you set the first control for 40 moves (or any non-zero number), then the move count will trigger the 2nd control. But if you set it for 00 moves, then the time expiration will trigger the 2nd control.
Have fun directing with increment! Maybe you’ll want to print out Micah’s document (which is thorough, almost to the point of agony) just to cover all bases.
Bill Smythe
I’ve had to explain this to players as a TD several times.
FYI, I will be adding information on the new TAP N Set clock to my increment document once I get one of these clocks or find a copy of the manual online.
The Chronos Blitz setting is TC-2.
Set the first time control to 40/90 +30.
Set the second time control to 30 +30.
Set for “No beeps” and you should be good.
- Enrique
Except this doesn’t set it correctly since you aren’t getting the increment for move one (starting with 1:30:30).
Does that setting do an add-before-moving (when the opponent hits the clock) or add-after-moving (when you hit the clock).
If it does add-before then does starting white’s clock still gives the 30 seconds (and white hitting the clock to stop white and start black would give black the 30 seconds). In that case both players get the full increment (being able to spend 1:30:29 on the first move before flagging) even though they do not see their full time immediately after completing their move, but instead have to wait until the opponent completes the move before they can see their full time for their move.
Odd that I don’t see FIDE mentioned in Steve’s request.
- Enrique
You get the increment for move one under US Chess rules as well. Why wouldn’t you? (US Chess rules consider, for example, G/30;d0, and G/25;inc5 to be equivalent based on the total playing time a player gets for a sixty move game but they are only equivalent if the increment is applied for move one). There will likely be a TD TIP added to the rulebook that explains you do get the increment for move one under US Chess rules to clear up this confusion.
So set the first control to 40/90:30 +30. If the Chronos Blitz can’t set seconds of main time, you’re out of luck.
If it does add-before, then there is no problem, because all (AFAIK) of those add-before monstrosities would automatically add increment for move 1 to begin with. (That’s their only advantage.)
But I’ve never seen a Chronos that would do add-before, and I hope to never see one.
FIDE schmeeday. It’s a good question for U.S.Chess as well.
Bill Smythe
The only way to set seconds on the Chronos Blitz/GX/FX for a multiple time control or a time control with a base time of at least 100 minutes is to start the clock for White’s first move, pause it, manually add the seconds, add back any time White lost for move one when you started the clock for White’s first move, and correct the move counter if you are using one of the options with a move counter.
All Chronos clocks do “add-after” but unfortunately they do not automatically give the increment for move one.
+1
You can still do it (kind of) for the Chronos Blitz. Set the first time control as 41/90:30 +30 and do an extra double-punch at the beginning.
That will give you your 90:30 in the first time control with forty more moves before reaching the second time control.
First of all, equivalent has an meaning quite different from what you’re saying. (There are many players who would never, ever, ever, play G/30;d0 who would be fine with G/25;inc5.) Second, US Chess does not use a “60 move” calculation; it says to add the base time to the delay/increment to determine what rating class a time control belongs to. Yes, 60 x 5 seconds = 5 minutes. That’s arithmetic, not rules.
First, I was saying they are equivalent in terms of the “total playing time” a player gets for the game based on a sixty move game (if the increment is applied for move one). Second, why does it say add the base time and increment/delay to determine what rating system a time control is rated under? Because it is basing things on a 60-move game!
True, but the players will still have to remember that the move counter is off by one, and that the extra time will be added after the real-40th-move-but-the-displayed-41st-move.
Unless, of course, the move counter counts down from 41 (or 40) to zero, instead of upward from 0 to 40.
Bill Smythe
Setting this time control on a Zmart Fun II clock is a multi-step process. Press and hold the select (middle) button to enter the setting mode. You should now see “HH:NN” blinking on both displays. If you see numbers blinking instead, just press the right touch pad once and then you will see “HH:NN” blinking on both displays. Press the right touch pad until you see “INC” blinking on the left display and ZZ blinking on the right display. ZZ = the number of increment seconds. Press the select button and only the ZZ will now be blinking. Press the right touch pad to increase (left pad to decrease) the value to “30” and then press the select button. You should now see blinking “INC” on the left and blinking “30” on the right. Press the right touch pad until you see the “P-XX YYY” setting (this will probably be “P-00” on the left and “000” on the right). Press the select button on this setting, and the display changes to “1-XX” (probably “1-00”) on the left display and “YYY” (probably “000”) on the right display. The XX will be blinking. XX = number of moves in the first time period; you can change it to “40” using the touch pads (right to increase and left to decrease) and then press the select button. After pressing the select button, the YYY starts blinking. YYY = number minutes in this (first) time period. Change it to “090” using the touch pads and then press the select button. After pressing the select button, the left display will show “-ALL” with the word “ALL” blinking. “ALL” = all the rest of the moves in the game (Sudden Death). Since you only have two time periods, just press the select button again. If you wanted to have more than two time periods, then press either touch pad. This will cause the left display to change to “2-XX” with the XX blinking. As above, XX is the number of moves in the current (second) time period. Press the opposite touch pad to return to “-ALL” and press the select button; the YYY will start blinking. Use the touch pads to select the number of minutes (“030”) for the Sudden Death time period and then press the select button. You should now see blinking “P-40” on the left display and blinking “090” on the right display. With both displays blinking, press the right pad until you either see a blinking “FIDE” in the left display or a blinking “PLAY”. There are two versions of ZMart Fun II clock. The older version does not have “FIDE” while the new version does. If there is no “FIDE” setting then the clock probably should not be used for FIDE competition since it will not halt the clock when one player runs out of time. However, if you see a blinking “FIDE” on the left display and a blinking “ON” (or if it says, “OFF” just press the select button to change it) on the right display, then just proceed pressing the right touch pad until you see a blinking “PLAY” on the left display and a blinking “----” on the right display (“LED” is for the indicator light on top of the clock showing which player is on move and “SOUN” is for beeps when players press the touch pad completing their move; just press the select button to toggle between “ON” and “OFF” for these settings as well) and then press the select button. You will now see “01:30” on both displays. This will give you the desired result of 40/90, SD/30; +30.
It should also be noted that the current version of the ZMF II has an option to set a multiple time control with the move counter off.
From the manual, zmfchess.com/wp-content/uploads … -07-15.pdf, “Choose 2t or 3t for two or three time controls respectively with the move counter off (New Feature).”
Wow; I didn’t know that part. Thank you! 