Anyone have an answer to this? Game in 90, sudden death, no delay on clock. White has 33 seconds left on clock, Black, 4:55. White has a rook and King, Black, a rook, bishop and king. There is no TD present. There is not a forced trade of rooks in the position. No one is in check. White stops the clock calling a draw under the C player vs GM rule. What should the ruling be?
As a C player, I’ve never decided if I should be honored or insulted by that rule.
I would rule that the game is NOT a draw at this time, but would note the player’s claim for a possible revision of my ruling if the other player cannot demonstrate a winning plan with his remaining time or afterwards, and then I would monitor the remainder of the game closely, making a final ruling, if necessary, once a flag has fallen. I have seen far too many players drop pieces in ‘clear draw’ situations. However, by taking formal note of the claim, that should take some of the time pressure of the player with less time.
If I had a delay clock available, I’d probably try to put it on the game, as 5 seconds per move should be sufficient for the ‘C player’ in a ‘C player vs GM’ situation.
The claim must be rejected. Rook and Bishop against Rook is a very difficult draw, and several IMs and GMs have managed to lose it with plenty of time on the clock. This is explicitly covered in 14I7.
There is no “C player can draw the master” rule. Just like there is no “put a digital delay clock on the game” rule.
The claim should be rejected until a proper 14 H (Claim of insufficient losing chances in sudden death) claim is made. To make that claim an analog clock has to be used in the game. If a digital delay clock is being used the claim can’t be made.
When a proper 14H claim is made it is the same as offering your opponent a draw. If the draw is accepted the game is over.
If the draw is rejected the TD gets to put a properly set digital delay clock on the game (it is always a wise choice to let the players decide the outcome of a game) or decide if a C player could draw a master in the position on the board and declare the game a draw or reject the claim.
Tim Just
My question is, what in bloody #### was white doing, using a clock without the delay set? He deserves whatever he gets, including a wide variety of different approaches from different TDs (or, in this case, a wide variety of TD availability!).
No TD in his right mind should ever declare R+B vs R drawn, on request of the player with the R. It’s WAY too hard to draw that one.
If a delay clock had been in use from the beginning of the game, white would probably still have lost – unless he demonstrated unusual skill, thus proving that he has earned the draw.
Bill Smythe
Bill Smythe:
14H2d. The claim is clearly incorrect. A director believes the claim is clearly incorrect should deny the claim and may subtract up to one minute from the claimant’s remaining time.
Since white only has 33 seconds on the clock, rule 14H2d will end the game. Yeppers, white should have a delay clock!
Despite what you and the other technophiles would like, not everyone has (or wants) a time-delay clock. In any case, as I already pointed out, this is explicitly covered in 14I7. The claim is clearly incorrect, and there is no room for TD discretion.
Isn’t there a rule that says a player cannot lose on time as a result of a time penalty imposed by the TD?
The only place this can come up is in a 14H claim, since that is the only infraction for which time is deducted from the player’s clock. (For everything else, the standard penalty is to add two minutes to the opponent’s clock.) What the rule says (14H2d) is that the TD “may subtract up to one minute from the claimant’s remaining time.” (Emphasis mine.) I would interpret this to mean that you should not deduct more time than the player has left, but this is not explicitly stated, and you might get a different argument from another TD.
USCF Blitz Rules
2. Claim of insufficient losing chances. A player must have less than one minute of remaining time to make a claim. This means that if the claim is denied, one minute is subtracted from claimant’s time, causing an automatic lose. All other procedures are the same as those described in 14H.
Only the rule 14H2d and the USCF Blitz rule 2 states any penalties I know of subtracted time from the clock. Rule 14H2d only says the director has the right to subtract. Its’ not clear if the subtracted time can cause an automatic lose. Only the USCF Blitz rule 2 makes it clear, a subtracted minute can be a automatic lose. In the above game, both players are now under five minutes and White only has 33 seconds. Since rule 14H2d gives the director the right to subtract 1 minute without being clear it can be or cannot be an automatic lose. The only other area that gives a director an understanding of a subtracted minute, is the USCF Blitz rule 2. The rule is very clear, a subtracted minute can cause an automatic lose.