In the first round of my round robin tournament, a player using a Chronos clock apparently flagged. The time control was GAME/120 with five second INCREMENT. This was clearly announced in the advance publicity, and my instructions were to set the digital clocks that way before the round. In any event, when I was called to the board the clock for this player indicated that he had 1:30:11 remaining in the second time control. The little dash was displayed. His opponent had made a time forfeit claim, and after much reading of the rule book, I couldn’t find any reason to deny the claim. I did invite the player to appeal, however.
Two hours later, the player’s father called my attention to rule 16Gb, specifically the part where it says if the clock is set incorrectly the flag is considered to have fallen prematurely. He argued that because the clock went into a second time control (as opposed to flashing all zeroes), it was set incorrectly, and thus the flag fall was premature.
Please note that since this is a round robin tournament, this result had no bearing on the pairings for subsequent rounds.
So he is claiming that if the clock was set for 40/120, SD/90, and that he got into the 2nd time control that it isn’t a loss?
The question is what was the clock actually set for, and can you determine how much time was actually used.
My interpretation of the clock being set incorrectly would be if 90 minutes into the round a player claimed a time win when his opponent’s clock read 0 and his clock read 30 minutes. Obviously it was incorrectly set at G/60 instead of G/120; and you resume play with an hour added to each clock.
Just my 2 cents worth.
Alex, can you add more information as to what the apparent clock settings were?
The apparent (and actual) clock settings were for two hours with five second increment. After the player’s time expired, he received an extra hour and a half. Does this answer the question?
If this was a FIDE rated round robin, didn’t you have plenty of time to inspect the clocks at the start of each round to ensure that they were set properly?
It appears virtually certain that the clock was set for 120 minutes, then 90 minutes. So if the clock indicated the second control, he had used up his 120 minutes and forfeited. In the seconds preceding the forfeit, he had no way of knowing how (or whether) the second control was set, or what would appear when his 120 ran out, so it had no effect on his actions leading up to the control. Therefore, he should be forfeited, no question.
The father’s argument was preposterous – one of those twisted chess-lawyer things that people try to argue when they have no case.
I’m not sure there was any mention of this being a FIDE rated tournament. I’m vaguely amused by the idea of the father of a player in a FIDE rated tournament complaining to the arbiter.
In any case, it’s not obvious to me how to tell how a Chronos clock is set once it is running.
I agree that the father’s claim is ludicrous, even ignoring the fact that the father is not one of the players. The rule about incorrectly set clocks applies if, for instance, it is clear that the time control could not have expired yet. (Add up the time used on both clocks. If that is much more than the actual time since the start of the round, then the clocks must have either been set incorrectly or must be defective [one or both sides are “running fast”].)
Alex has posted several other questions in the Forums about running a FIDE rated round robin this weekend, it doesn’t seem like much of a stretch to connect those posts with this question.
My point in doing so was to note that the Arbiter in a FIDE event tends to have a more active role than the TD in a USCF rated event. Making sure the boards and clocks are set properly and being present to observe players at time control (and call the flags per FIDE rules) are two of the things I would expect an Arbiter to do, especially someone who’s trying to earn credits for a FA or IA title, which I think Alex is. (He has far more ambition and energy than I do.)
There are several A players in Oklahoma who are under 20, a FIDE rated futurity seems quite possible (and an excellent idea!)
BTW, FIDE events are not immune from chess parents.
Mike is absolutely correct. Actually, I’m running two FIDE-rated round robins this weekend, as well as a swiss, with considerably fewer than the number of arbiters than one would expect at a major event. This one is a seven master and one strong expert (2223 FIDE, 2167 USCF) event, and three of the players have their fathers here. Only three of the players are resident Oklahomans, the other five are frequent guests in our tournaments.
In any event, was the clock even technically mis-set? I remember there being another topic maybe a year ago debating what was supposed to happen at the end of the time control. I don’t remember anything conclusive determined, and I wouldn’t know how to check for that anyway.
Also, aren’t most FIDE rated events in the U.S. run according to USCF rules? For example, I haven’t had anyone complain to me yet that his opponent was writing the moves before playing them, but I have little doubt that some are.
Actually, I believe FIDE and the USCF adopted that rule for the same reason, because note-taking should not be sanctioned. In the USCF’s case, keeping pace with FIDE was a secondary concern.
I suspect there have been cases where FIDE adjusted their rules because of USCF rules, though I haven’t been involved in FIDE rules enough to know of any specific examples.
There was a discussion at the Technical Commission meeting in Turin with regards to what the clock should do at then end of a time control intermediary or final.)
I’m not sure if the commission report has been made available on the FIDE website yet, and I don’t recall all the specifics because I got to the meeting in the middle of that discussion.
However, I think that in the final time control the clock is supposed to conclusively indicate that time has expired. Going on to a next time control probably doesn’t meet that test, though if the Arbiter is aware of the clock setting and is watching the game to call the flag, it is probably sufficient to make the call, even if not technically correct.
Sigh, I hadn’t paid enough attention to make that connection myself. I plead temporary insanity based on directing a three day tournament during the long weekend.
The only insanity is trying to do much of anything else while running a tournament! Even if there are long moments when the TD has very little to do, the next potential crisis may be just around the corner.
Working as a TD at events tends to tire me out more than playing in them.
Here’s how with a Chronos Blitz (can’t tell you if this works with the other Chronos models, but it’s worth a try): Press the red button to stop the clock. Now long-press the red button until the display starts to flash, indicating that it’s now in “set” mode. Successive presses of the red button will step you through all the parameters that define the current clock setting:
1st time control
delay for 1st time control
increment for 1st time control
final delay for 1st time control
2nd time control
delay for 2nd time control
increment for 2nd time control
final delay for 2nd time control
9 thru x. As above for any additional time controls
x+1. beep on each move enabled/disabled
x+2. LED setting
x+3. beep at end enabled/disabled
x+4. beep at time control enabled/disabled
x+5. halt clock upon flag enabled/disabled
x+6. miscellaneous display option settings
x+7. offers to copy settings to a user mode - ignore this
Once you’ve inspected the settings, long-press the red button again to return the clock to “run” mode. Hopefully (I haven’t verified this myself yet) it will retain the elapsed times from when it was halted. Now press either the right or left button to resume play.
I have seen sometimes on the Chronos Blitz it reset itself when put into set mode. I’ve never had this problem on the one I own, but this has happened several times in tournaments I’ve directed when I’ve gone into set mode to add 2 minutes to a player’s clock for an illegal move. Since it happened with the same player each time I suspect his clock may be defective. I wonder if anyone lese has seen this problem with the blitz? I’ve never come across it with the standard Chronos.
Doesn’t work with the standard models (unless maybe it works with the very most recent versions). On the standard models, all you’ll see is the time remaining in the current control, plus the move count if the move counter was turned on. It does, however, provide a look at all five digits of the remaining time, even in modes (such as move-counting modes) which normally show only hours and minutes.
OK, it’s not quite as simple as I said. The Blitz preserves its current elapsed times only when in one of the following modes: tn-1, tn-2, tn-3, tn-u, tc-2, tc-3, tc-4, or tc-u (also known as modes 5 through 12). These include the multi-time control modes where mid-game inspection is most likely to be useful anyway.
If you try this with any of the remaining modes (F1-F4 or the user preset modes 1-4), you can still pause the clocks as indicated. A 2nd press of the red button (whether short or long) resets both times, and it takes a 3rd long-press to enter “set” mode. This may explain what you’ve seen, and this mode-dependent behavior may actually be designed-in (for reasons known only to the manufacturer).
I’m quite sure this clock behavior is indeed deliberate, and is done because:
In the longer (tournament) modes, a mid-game time adjustment is more likely to be necessary than in blitz modes.
In the blitz modes, it is desirable to be able to reset the clock quickly, for the next game, with just one or two button presses. A mid-game time adjustment feature would increase the number of button presses necessary to reset for the next game.
But I don’t agree with reason number 2. Chronos would do well to implement the mid-game adjustment feature in all modes. So what if it takes five button presses instead of two to reset? Personally, I prefer something like CH-A1 even for blitz. Five quick center-button presses resets in a second or so.
