I played in a tournament last weekend, classical time control (40/100, 10 sec delay). Through the opening, my opponent started making his move as soon as I released my piece (maybe even before that), before I hit my clock. In some cases, he hit the clock at the same time I did, and it didn’t even register that a move had been made in the move counter. (Yes, I’m aware that the clock move counter isn’t official). In addition to this being poor etiquette, is it even legal?
In the analog clock era, it was very common for players to do this. One remedy was to press the clock and hold the button down firmly so that the opponent could not push his button instantly after your push. Of course, this usually led to a row and a call of the TD to the table to resolve the issue. The TD would admonish both players for their behavior. Sometimes it worked, sometimes not, leading to fierce arguments and an occasional punch being thrown in a hallway if not immediately in the playing hall.
In the modern era, with touch sensor digital clocks, all sorts of new tricks are available for the devious player besides the speed push. Here is a new one. If you get up from the table to go to the bathroom, get a coffee, or a drink of water after you have pressed the button, the other player may press his button while you are away letting time spill from your clock. When you are on the way back to the board, he furtively touches your button so that he still remains on move, but you have lost several minutes. You need to pay attention to your clock and write the time down after your move before you leave the board. If there is a discrepancy in time, pause the clock and get the TD. You may have to take the clock with you when you do this. Yes, there will be a scene, but you cannot let clock felons have their way. This is one more reason why players stop playing in tournaments. They are sick of dealing with the tricks and antics of their opponents. Most players are good, moral, and ethical, but when you run into the increasing number of bad ones it takes the fun out of the game. Before my students play in tournaments, it is sad to have to inform them what they may face in big money tournaments, or even in large scholastic events where the battle for trophies is sometimes scandalous.
If your opponent is making a move before you’ve even released a piece then there is a potential complaint for distracting you during your move.
You are always allowed to hit the clock after making your move. I’ve seen blitz games between a quick presser and a slow presser where: the slow player made a move and started reaching for the clock; the quick player made a move and hit the clock (not really doing anything on the clock since the slow player’s clock was still running); the slow player finally hit the clock (and is fully within the rules to do so); and now the slow player was on move while the quick player’s clock was running.
In general, your move is not completed until your clock has been stopped and your opponent’s clock started. Once the piece has been moved and released, you no longer have the option to change your move, but the move is not yet completed. (Note that you do NOT have to write your move down before pressing the clock.)
If your opponent was making a move with one hand and hitting the clock with the other, that’s a violation that is covered in the rules.
Otherwise, if your opponent wants to play mind games with you, play them back. Make your move on the board, then S L O W L Y move your hand over to the clock button, hold your hand over it for a few seconds, then press it.
Apparently a coach was telling his elementary student(s) (I’m not sure of the number but I’m assuming it was more than just one student) not to press the clock right away after having made the move on the board. Some of the opponents would get impatient waiting for the player to press the clock and would reply before the player, apparently sitting there deliberately letting the clock run, finally pressed the clock (in an attempt to have the opponent penalized for moving before the player pressed the clock).
This question is easily resolved by reading the rule book, notably rules 6B and 9G.
So, in regular rated and quick rated play, it is not permitted for the opponent to move (or to touch any pieces) until the player has pressed the clock. (Yes, yes, there is always the argument of “what if the player forgets to press the clock?” In that case, the opponent is not obliged to remind the player to press the clock. If the opponent waits a reasonable time and then moves while the player’s clock is running, the player is unlikely to make a claim to the TD, and the game will continue.)
However, the US Chess blitz rules redefine completion of a move:
The following sequence is therefore legal under US Chess blitz rules:
- White moves a piece.
- Black moves a piece.
- White presses the clock.
- Black presses the clock.
Once you have determined (i.e. played) your move, you are entitled to a clock press. If the opponent jumps in quickly with his move, both determining it (i.e. playing it) and “completing” it (i.e. dummy-pressing his clock), then you are still entitled to a clock press. If you avail yourself of this entitlement, your opponent’s clock will now be running even though it is now your move. It is then up to your opponent to notice this, and to press his own clock (this time for real) again. If he fails to notice, he might end up losing a lot of time, or even losing the game by time forfeit. This will serve him right for his attempt to deprive you of a clock press.
Bill Smythe
Next time it happens, play this game… youtu.be/NT0epw9P7-o
Emphasis added.
The player may be virtually certain that their opponent is a “clock felon”; the TD does not have that knowledge. It would be preferable to stop the clock & raise one’s hand to summon a TD.
It would make so much more sense, even in blitz, that a player cannot touch a piece or hover their hand over the board, until the opponent has moved AND punched the clock.
I won’t say you’re wrong.
On the other hand, this is a case where the US Chess rules and the FIDE Laws of Chess differ. The Laws of Chess do not have the concept of “determined” vs. “completed” moves, and the opponent moving before the player has pressed the clock is acceptable in all time controls. There is no problem with not having a chance to claim a draw, as FIDE disallows all draw claims once a piece has been touched.
I disagree. FIDE does have the concept, but the terminology is different. Where U.S. Chess says I have “determined” the move, FIDE says I have “made” the move. And both have the same definition of “completed”.
Bill Smythe
The discussions and rules would be cleaner if the term ‘turn’ were used, instead of overloading the term ‘move’.
I disagree with Mr. Coyote, because the rules cited do not answer the question at all.
Ken’s own statement about - “…opponent waits a reasonable time…” seems like a good idea, but his words are not in the rules he cites.
Bottom line is that your opponent does have the legal right to physically make his reply move even before you press your clock. Of course, you retain the right to press your clock.
If a fix is needed, the rule book must discuss the cases where a player moves his piece, and then either (A) forgets to press his clock, or (B) leaves the board without pressing his clock.
I did not pay for the 6th edition rule book, so I cannot speak to whether the rule book discusses these explicitly, in rules other than those cited in Mr. Coyote’s post.
If this is true, and I don’t believe it is, it is a terrible loop-hole. I have warned players before, and will continue to do so, that it is not their move until the opponent has stopped his clock; if they continue, penalties apply.
Mr. Milener is directed to this thread. http://www.uschess.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=24431
Alex Relyea
I think Mr. Milener has misread Mr. Ballou’s post. IMO, Mr. Ballou clearly agrees that the opponent has no right to move when the player has (apparently) forgotten to press the clock. It is Mr. Ballou’s (and my) opinion that a player who has forgotten to press the clock is unlikely to claim that his opponent moved on his move. Recall that there is rarely a violation, under the Official Rules of Chess when there is no complaint. Phones ringing and some illegal moves are exceptions to this.
Alex Relyea
No.
Brennan as usual doesn’t explain his reasoning, but I would have to agree with him. Rules have to be enforceable. In a time scramble you’re going to penalize someone for making a move instantly when the opponent finishes their move, just because the opponent didn’t punch their clock? Seems like new fertile ground for gamesmanship and rules lawyering to me. Blitz is all about reflexes, and if you penalize someone for having quick reflexes, that’s wrong. Hovering, maybe. I’m fine with restricting activities before the move is determined and for giving the player the chance to press the clock. Anything stronger than that seems suspect to me.
Football players must have quick reflexes; yet they are not allowed to commit pass interference.
Mr. Relyea is almost completely correct. I would, however, change the word “violation” to “penalty” in his penultimate sentence. Technically, the violation still exists; there are no consequences in the absence of a claim.
I will state this in such a manner that no reasonable person could interpret it otherwise: Under US Chess rules for regular and quick rated play, at no time whatsoever do the rules allow the opponent to move while the player’s clock is running. Regardless of how long the opponent waits for the player to realize he has not pressed his clock, the opponent commits a rules violation by moving when the player’s clock is still running. Nonetheless, almost every tournament director reading these words has witnessed a game in which this exact behavior happens. Yet, the game simply proceeds because the player does not make a claim.
The same argument applies to instances when a player touches a piece that can be moved legally but then moves a different piece. The opponent may not know that he needs to claim the violation, or the opponent may actually want the player’s move to stand (as it is an inferior move). Even if the tournament director witnesses the behavior, under US Chess rules, in the absence of a claim, the tournament director takes no corrective action. That does not mean there was no rules infraction.