I am not quite sure where to put this, but I wanted some input. I am new to correspondence chess and just registered for an E-Knights round.
There are 2 people in the section that have significant discrepencies between their CC and OTB rating. One is rated 2375 CC and is 1388 OTB. This is a recent rating including playing in the parents and friends in KC with a score of 2.0, losing to a 1500 and a 1600.
The other has a 2035 CC rating and is 1353 OTB, again recent rating with 2 tournaments in the last couple of months.
How likely is this? Is this something the USCF looks for?
Again, I am just new to CC, so I am throwing the question out.
There are some good reasons a person’s OTB and CC ratings could be quite different.
First, check (if you can) how long the person has been playing CC chess. A victory over 3 unrated players and one player rated 1975 (with no losses) would give a new CC player a pretty high rating for a while. Even if the player were only 1500 or 1600 in STRENGTH, a single win over a 1900 rated player is possible. (I’ve had 1900 rated opponents drop a piece before – it happens, even in CC).
Second, there really can be a difference in playing ability, though this seems pretty big in the example you gave. I’d estimate that my own strength is 100 or more points higher at a slow time control than at G/30, and maybe another hundred points higher at CC. My game is simply more suited to longer time controls (most of my losses are from blunders). But the example you gave seems to be a rather big difference.
Another thing to keep in mind is that some people have disabilities that really interfere with their OTB play, but don’t hamper them much in CC. I remember an unusual example coming up on the forums: a player complained that he had trouble seeing a 3-dimensional chess board, but could see a demo board (or computer screen) just fine.
The bottom line is to just check things out first. Even ask your opponent why there’s such a big difference. Just do so in a non-accusatory manner.
That looks darn near impossible for somebody with a 1380 OTB rating, unless there’s some real good story to go with that OTB rating. I don’t know of others’ experience, but I don’t think I have met such a person in my life.
I guess that gets back to my question. Since these are USCF sponsored tourneys, do I just let the TD know that this smells bad to me? Is there any kind of procedure for the USCF to look at this sort of thing, or is it just kind of assumed that there is going to be cheating in CC?
Databases eliminate quite a few of the more common mistakes. Does the USCF allow databases? Just about every CC organization I’ve played in allows databases and endgame tables.
The main restriction is that you can’t use a chess engine to evaluate a position. You can use game collections, opening books, endgame books, etc.
I’ve got a really nice collection of games and some really good engame books on DVD. I’ve played more than one CC game where I didn’t have to make an original move until my opponent had already blundered into a loss.
The USCF definately DOES NOT look the other way when it comes to CC cheating. However, it would be very hard to prove. In OTB play it would be very unlikely for an average person to play an entire game making the “best” moves (according to a computer). But it occasionally happens – even to Class chess players like me (I’ve played ONE game OTB against a similar rated opponent where the computer found no errors by me in post game analysis). It’s easier to believe it in a CC game, though, because the player can literally spend hours looking at each position (and can play through variations and take notes to his heart’s content).
Theres one other possible explanation for the difference in ratings that I didn’t mention before: age. I don’t want to offend anybody, but it’s a fact that OTB play declines for some people as they get older and players that were quite good at 40/2 games 20 years ago just don’t play very well at all at G/40 OTB events (like one “friends and family” event that I played in). CC play, on the other hand, may actually IMPROVE because the player has a lot more time for playing (kids all moved away, retired from work, etc).
A database doesn’t turn a 1300 player into an 1800 player (especially since his opponents have access to the same databases, and ratings are relative measures) let alone a 2300 player.
Philosophically I would not be optimistic about the situation you’re facing. Just figure you’re playing a 2300 player (you are, even if the player consists of more than the human) and expect the result appropriately.
Nothing can be proved, except that your opponent’s actual performance has produced that rating, so that’s what you are facing.
It’s not all that unusual. Glancing at the 2006 “Top 100 Correspondence Players” list, I found these (first is OTB, second is correspondence): 1836/2445, 1735/2439, 1679/2419, 1418/2420, 1536/2410, 1626/2397.
At least, with their CC ratings higher than OTB, you know they’re not sandbagging (CC), which is all you really should care about.
I think you said both opponents had OTB ratings based on only 2 events each. So, while they may be extremely experienced when they can sit and analyze for hours in the comfort of their homes, it’s possible they freak out when put in the new situation of OTB, with the clock ticking, touch-move, spectators, etc. Maybe they’re hermits, who have finally been coaxed to a live event by friends.
I have been playing an a Walter Muir E-tournament (no relation) with 3 other unrateds, one of whom is creaming everyone and only remains to beat me in his last game which will likely happen soon. That gets played on the ICCF web server which is pretty cool. My guess is that some of these people in correspondence chess just spend three times as long as I do figuring out their moves. That’s why their rating can be so much higher than their OTB rating, because they use the time to make sure they make the very best move.
On the topic of cheating, its possible they do. But, I doubt it. What would be the point? There’s no money prizes. There would be better ways for cheaters to spend their valuable time in life. I assume that my opponents are playing honestly and just enjoy playing chess.
Thanks for all the input everyone. I won’t worry about it too much. I didn’t have a lot of expectations of getting 4.5 out of this section anyway! I still may ask him what his secret to success is.
Personally, I am finding I do not have the patience for correspondence play that I thought I would. I much prefer OTB. Somehow there’s something much more satisfying about playing your opponents in person!
I’m in the unique position of having a lower CC rating than my OTB rating, but this is because I have played in two CC tournaments, once at age 12 (I turned 36 today) and once 10 years ago, when I unfortunately had to withdraw mid tournament after scoring +2 -0 =0.
I have recently started playing again, and I expect that my rating will eventually surpass my OTB rating. The ability to consult books and databases generally insures that I reach a playable middlegame and should eventually improve my opening knowledge for OTB play.
Of course, I simply have to trust that all players are adhering to the no non-published assistance rule, and my opponents have to trust me to do the same. I’m fine with that. Unlike large prize fund OTB tournaments, the incentive to cheat is not terribly high. In the Golden Knights or even the E-Knights, it will take years for the first prize to be determined. I can think of a billion ways to get a better return on investment per hour than cheating at correspondence chess.
Furthermore, February’s OTB cheating article indicates that it may soon be prohibited to check cell phone or email messages during a round in some major tournaments. I am a junior associate at a very busy law firm. If I don’t check email for six hours when something is breaking, even on a weekend, I could get fired. I don’t have to worry about this issue in correspondence play.
Your law firm needs to realize that the benefits of excellence in chess playing far outweigh the importance of any legal matter! Its ridiculous that they can’t give you a break for a weekend.
Or like me, you could find a legal job in the government sector–40 hours per week does allow for plenty of OTB tournament play! Of course, the financial rewards and job satisfaction are probably a lot less.
I still may ask him what his secret to success is.